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John Fineberg
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May 21, 2014 at 9:50 am
It took a bit of work (with your valuable help) to get Calendar Table to work and lay out nicely in EE3. If I’m reading your release correctly, Calendar Table is not available in EE4. Is that correct? If so, is there a screen shot somewhere of what those listings will look like if I upgrade to EE4 now?
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Tony
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May 21, 2014 at 10:31 am
Hi John,
You are correct, the Custom Template Add-on (and therefore Calendar Table template) is not available for EE4.
One of the big differences between EE3 and EE4 is that EE4 uses a Custom Post Type for events. What this means is that your theme will handle a lot of the styling although we do have some default styling applied also.
The best way to view the new layout is to either install EE4 locally on a test site, or register on demoee.org, create a test event and then view the events pages there.
You can view some screenshots on our blog post:
https://eventespresso.com/2014/02/event-espresso-4-beta-officially-released/
Although I do not believe that is what you are looking for, which is why I recommended demoee.org
Does that help?
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John Fineberg
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May 21, 2014 at 10:55 am
I created a test site back when that was first announced. I must be doing something wrong, as all I see there is a dashboard of what the administrator would see, not what a site visitor would see. Advice?
I went to https://eventespresso.com/2014/02/event-espresso-4-beta-officially-released/ and saw a lot of screen shots at the bottom of the page, again from the administer perspective, not the visitor perspective. I did see one shot at the top of the page, a photo of John Travolta (or a John Travolta-lookalike). Is that the screen shot you mean? I see “tickets” for sale. That was one of things I had work with EE on, as we don’t sell tickets to classes, we “register” for classes. Is there a work-around for that?
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John Fineberg
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May 21, 2014 at 11:11 am
Here’s an example of what my registration page looks right now:
http://www.cpr-twincities.com/community/cpr
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Lorenzo Orlando Caum
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May 21, 2014 at 11:24 am
Hi John,
We do have some options available for changing the the word “tickets” to something else in Event Espresso 4.
Is this something that you are interested in?
—
Lorenzo
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John Fineberg
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May 21, 2014 at 11:38 am
I’m still interested in seeing what my page would look like. As mentioned before, I’ve already created a test site, but don’t have the faintest idea of how to see it. All I see is the internal workings, from the administrator’s perspective, not the external workings, from the visitor’s perspective. Could you tell me how to see it?
And I’d like to know what the process is to change the word “tickets” for something else.
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Lorenzo Orlando Caum
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May 21, 2014 at 1:47 pm
You would need to go to the front end of your site and go to the events page or a single event page.
Here are two options for changing the text:
https://eventespresso.com/wiki/how-to-change-wording-with-poedit/#plugins
—
Lorenzo
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John Fineberg
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May 21, 2014 at 3:09 pm
I think you answered my second question, though I’m hoping that the code I entered last time will survive the transition from 3 to 4.
Now, as for my first question?
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Lorenzo Orlando Caum
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May 21, 2014 at 5:39 pm
If you are in the WordPress admin (back end), you would need to browse to the front end of the site to see the event pages.
Its the same process as any WordPress site. Just open a new tab with the current URL and remove /wp-admin/ from the end. Then go to that updated URL and that will show you the front end.
WP-admin:
example.com/wp-admin/
Front end:
example.com
—
Lorenzo
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John Fineberg
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May 22, 2014 at 9:11 am
I’ve done what you said, and all I get is “Hello World,” meaning that nothing from my actual site made it over to the demo site (http://demoee.org/cprtwincitiesdemo/). Can’t you simply show me an example of what I could expect a page like this (http://www.cpr-twincities.com/community/cpr) to look like? You must have screen shots available, don’t you?
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Tony
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May 23, 2014 at 4:48 am
Apologies John,
To explain a little more the Custom Template Add-on you are currently using the display that list of event pulls the events from EE3 and then uses the template we created to style those events in the manor you can see currently.
If you were to install EE4 right now, that page would display nothing more than the shortcode currently in use on that page as the Custom Template Add-on is not compatible with EE4.
The problem is that as EE4 uses Custom Post Types they are more heavily styled by your theme than events within EE3. So the screenshots we could show you will likely be slightly different from your site as we will not be using your theme. The general layout should be the same, but possibly not.
So to demonstrate I pulled the info from the events within the list you posted and created them within EE4 on one of my test sites, then opened up the events list ‘page’ (is actually an archive)
This is how it was displayed using twentyfourteen theme – http://awesomescreenshot.com/0852uro8b2
Then within the event themselves – http://take.ms/y6Uw1 & http://take.ms/Fa0GS
(The image I randomly pulled from your site to demo a feature image)
Then I switched to another theme I had installed on that site.
The events list (archive) – http://take.ms/rONGE
Within the events once again – http://take.ms/X6gg3 & http://take.ms/Gb59c
In both cases I have made no changes to the default output from EE4 or the theme and it is the exact same event just with the theme switched.
Notice the subtle differences between each theme, it is dependant upon how the theme styles the posts. You can override this and create your own custom theme templates (we have child theme included within EE4) but how events are currently displayed will depend on how the theme outputs posts mixed with our output.
Does that help?
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John Fineberg
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May 23, 2014 at 8:07 am
Yes, Tony, that does help. Even though, as I now understand, my theme will alter how it looks, I have a decent idea of what to expect. It’s not as exciting as the Calendar Table, but it’s clean looking, which might be easier to read in the end.
Will all of my settings and such automatically get imported into EE4? And will I need to change anything in My Custom CSS:
.events.widget {
height: 500px;
width: 97%;
overflow-y: scroll !important;
}
.event_espresso_form_wrapper .multi-checkbox br {
display: none;
}
.event_espresso_form_wrapper .single-radio br {
display: none;
}
.event_espresso_form_wrapper .event_questions ul li {
margin-left: 0px;
}
.event_espresso_form_wrapper .event_questions ul {
margin-left: 0px;
padding-left: 0px;
}
.multi-checkbox label {
width: 100% !important;
}
.event_espresso_form_wrapper form fieldset div {
padding: 0.50em 0;
}
.spaces-available {
display:none;
}
.fc-header-title h2 { opacity:1 !important; }
So I can plan ahead, is this something that could take hours, or even days, to get back up-to-speed? Or more like just minutes?
Can you give me the instructions as to how to change the wording of “Ticket Options,” “Available Tickets,” “Paid Admission” and such, as those words don’t apply when you’re registering and paying for a class?
I’ve come to expect great support from you and yours at Event Espresso. It’s disappointing when I don’t get it, and only get half-hearted, incomplete responses. But nearly all of you do an excellent job. Thanks for jumping back in, Tony.
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Tony
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May 23, 2014 at 8:35 am
It’s important to note, EE4 is not simply an update to EE3. (although you can update FROM EE3 to EE4)
EE4 is a totally new system that has been built from the ground up & has more features (although NOT the same feature set as EE3) for example, EE4 currently does not support Promo codes or any of functionality from the Add-on’s that EE3 has.
Will all of my settings and such automatically get imported into EE4?
Yes, but to be clear, this would be the admin side, (Events, Attendees, Registrations etc) that will transfer over. Not the front end and how the events are displayed.
Most (if not all) of the CSS posted will NOT apply to EE4.
So I can plan ahead, is this something that could take hours, or even days, to get back up-to-speed? Or more like just minutes?
Well this depends on more than a few factors. You are currently not using the default output from Event Espresso 3. (Which would be this page – http://www.cpr-twincities.com/register ) You use the Custom Templates Add-on to display your events. So the page you linked will basically stop functioning (in terms of EE) once EE4 is installed and if you wish to display events there you’ll need to use the EE4 shortcodes on that page, this will not be automatically done for you.
Sites using the standard event lists etc can simply migrate over and use the new style listings, your site will not be able to do this and so this is not something that will simply take minutes.
I would highly recommend NOT updating the live site without first creating a dev site (either locally of on a development server), cloning the site there and updating EE there, then you can work through any of the issues that may arise on that site and you’ll then know the work involved for the live site.
EE4 is in Beta and we are adding new features/bug fixes with each update. If EE4 currently does not suit your needs you may be better waiting on the update for a little, giving you time to also test EE4 on a clone of your site and learn the new event management style locally, leaving the live site working as is until ready.
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John Fineberg
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May 23, 2014 at 9:11 am
Much appreciated, Tony.
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John Fineberg
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May 27, 2014 at 3:34 pm
I think I’ll take your advice and wait for beta period to end. But so I understand a little more about EE4, I have a follow-up question.
Here’s an example of the code I have right now:
[EVENT_CUSTOM_VIEW template_name=”calendar-table” change_title=”Classes” event_category_id=”professional-training-1330119554″]
Once I switch over to EE4, where will I find the new shortcodes? Will they be generated for me somewhere in the transition from 3 to 4, or will I have to create them somehow manually?
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Lorenzo Orlando Caum
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May 27, 2014 at 6:57 pm
Hello,
The current shortcodes for Event Espresso 4 are available on the Help & Support tab in the WordPress admin.
We are also working on a page on our documentation site and it will be published there later this week.
The Event Custom View shortcode (for custom templates) is not currently available for the current version of EE4 but may be available in a future release.
—
Lorenzo
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John Fineberg
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May 28, 2014 at 1:12 pm
What would be the equivalent shortcode to use instead of the Event Custom View shortcode (using the code I provided earlier):
[EVENT_CUSTOM_VIEW template_name=”calendar-table” change_title=”Classes” event_category_id=”professional-training-1330119554”]
Or do IDs like “professional-training-1330119554” get replaced by something else? If so, do the changes appear automatically or is that something I’d need to create manually?
Regarding this statement:
“Sites using the standard event lists etc can simply migrate over and use the new style listings, your site will not be able to do this and so this is not something that will simply take minutes.”
I’m wondering if I eliminated the Custom View template, would that make the migration simpler? If so, is that just a matter of deactivating the “Custom Template Display” plugin?
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Lorenzo Orlando Caum
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May 28, 2014 at 1:24 pm
Hi,
There is no equivalent shortcode at this time for EE4 but this does not mean that a shortcode won’t be added to a future release.
The Custom Templates addon does not currently work with EE4 so it would need to be deactivated and the shortcodes removed from any post or pages.
If you need the custom templates addon, then we recommend continuing to use Event Espresso 3.
—
Lorenzo
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John Fineberg
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May 28, 2014 at 1:54 pm
I don’t need Custom Templates. I just prefer them to what EE3 displays normally.
So you’re saying that all Custom Templates code like this just disappears automatically in the upgrade from EE3 to EE4? Or does it need to be eliminated manually? And if the Custom Templates code gets dumped, isn’t there a similar non-Custom Templates code required to replace it? If so, what would be the replacement code?
How about Unique Event Identifiers (like cpraed-adult–5385062baeaa3)? Are they maintained in EE4? Does anything need to be done manually or does it just get automatically migrated? And what about Event Shortcode (like [SINGLEEVENT single_event_id=”cpraed-adult–5385062baeaa3″])? Same question, are the same codes used and is there anything that needs to be done or is it all automatic?
Back to my last question, if I deactivate Custom Templates before making the switch from EE3 to EE4, does this make the upgrade pretty much automatic?
This is a lot of questions, but they’re all related. Please do your best to answer each and every one of them.
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John Fineberg
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May 28, 2014 at 2:33 pm
And while I’m asking, do each of these EE3 items get migrated automatically, along with all of my current settings and other info:
Venues
Questions
Question Groups
Categories (and their associated shortcodes)
Email Manager (and their respective, custom-written emails)
Payment Settings
Here’s a suggestion: Perhaps you could use some of my questions to write a document for all people considering the update, so you didn’t have to waste valuable time answering so many individual questions from people like me who live by the adage, “look before you leap.”
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Lorenzo Orlando Caum
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May 28, 2014 at 3:11 pm
Unfortunately, I can’t answer your questions with certainty as you are asking about shortcodes that do not currently exist in EE4. I believe there will be an equivalent but again I can’t confirm any details on that.
The single event shortcode does not currently exist in EE4. The closest option is [ESPRESSO_TICKET_SELECTOR event_id=”your_event_id”]. This may change as EE4 matures.
The events category shortcode has been replaced with this and would need to be updated:
[ESPRESSO_EVENTS category_slug=”free-events”]
You can see available shortcodes for Event Espresso 4 by logging into your EE4 demo site on demoee.org and going to Event Espresso –> Help & Support.
When you migrate from EE3 to EE4, any shortcodes that are not supported will show the shortcode text on the page or post that they have been added to.
Venues, Questions, Questions Groups, and Payment Settings are migrated. The Custom email notifications are not migrated as the messages system was built from scratch for EE4. You would need to recreate any email notifications.
You should deactivate the Custom Template addon as it is not currently compatible with EE4. This may also change in the future.
—
Lorenzo
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John Fineberg
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May 28, 2014 at 3:35 pm
So the “Unique Event Identifiers” like cpraed-adult–5385062baeaa3 will remain the same without me lifting a finger? Using your example, it would be [ESPRESSO_TICKET_SELECTOR event_id=”cpraed-adult–5385062baeaa3″], correct?
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Dean
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May 29, 2014 at 2:27 am
Hi,
Unfortunately not. The ID in EE4 is the post id, so this would be numerical like 1 or 436.
While we have tried to migrate over as much of EE3 to EE4 as possible, there are some underlying structural differences as we have moved to Custom Post Types.
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John Fineberg
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May 29, 2014 at 7:27 am
Where and how are these EE4 IDs generated? I didn’t build this site myself; I just maintain what was built for me. So here’s a basic question: I know how to find the IDs, but does EE make them up or do I?
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Dean
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May 30, 2014 at 12:20 am
Hi John,
The ID’s are generated by WordPress. EE4 events are basically Posts, so every time a post is created (Post, Page, Custom Post Type, Navigation Menu, etc) the ID is incremented up.
http://codex.wordpress.org/Post_Types
As you are still using EE3 this is not a concern, but if/when you move over to EE4, some shortcodes (if they exist in EE4) may need updating.
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John Fineberg
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May 30, 2014 at 8:15 am
I’m sorry to take up so much of your time on this, but, as I am seriously considering EE4, I’m trying really hard to determine exactly what I’m going to need to do, and exactly how to do those things.
Installing and activating EE4 has good step-by-step instructions, but I haven’t seen any good documentation at all on any of the other things necessary — from tiny to huge — to get my site up and running smoothly again. Without that, I can’t imagine being willing to take the serious risk of being out of business while I scramble to figure it out.
By the way, I did create a demo site, though it’s bare bones and has none of my actual site on it, as it won’t allow me to import anything into it. If only I could find some instructions on how to do it, that would be extremely helpful.
I know that the pricing goes up on June 1, so I was hoping I might be able to get this done today. But, as we’ve been in communication on this forum for over a week now, I don’t know if that’s possible. Will it get easier once you get over the hump of beta to focus on helping people make the transition?
I’m perfectly happy with EE3, so let me be clear. If delaying is going to 1) give you more time to create step-by-step instructions, 2) improve the ability to automatically migrate more things, and 3) make the overall transition easier, I’m fine with not doing it now.
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Lorenzo Orlando Caum
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May 30, 2014 at 6:08 pm
Hi,
The IDs in EE4 can be found in the Event Overview screen in WP-admin –> Events Espresso –> Event.
Here is an example:
http://cl.ly/image/3a2O3X1d1h2P
The ids appear to the left of the event name. If you click on the help tab in the top right of the screen, then documentation will appear for that page.
—
Lorenzo
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John Fineberg
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May 30, 2014 at 9:39 pm
There is no “help” tab in the screen shot you posted. This is getting pretty fatiguing, asking the same questions over and over again, so please focus.
I asked if the IDs from EE3 get changed to the IDs in EE4, and whether the system generates the new IDs automatically. I still don’t know the answer to that.
I asked about automatic migration of these items happen automatically: Venues, Questions, Question Groups, Categories (and their associated shortcodes), Email Manager (and their respective, custom-written emails) and Payment Settings. You answered about five out of six of those, but skipped Categories.
I asked “if I eliminated the Custom View template, would that make the migration simpler? If so, is that just a matter of deactivating the “Custom Template Display” plugin?” I never got an answer to that question.
I also asked “if the Custom Templates code gets dumped, isn’t there a similar non-Custom Templates code required to replace it? If so, what would be the replacement code?” You answered that “there will be an equivalent,” but didn’t know what the equivalent would be. That’s a pretty critical part of switching from EE3 to EE4, so it’s something that you should know by now.
I said that I’ve created a demo site, but that none of my website is there, and that the demo site won’t allow me to import anything to it. I’ve gotten no help from you in resolving that problem.
I said that I was shooting for making the switch to EE4 today (after over a week’s worth of questions, some answered, but too many not answered). I said that I was hoping to beat the June 1 price increase. But I still don’t sufficient answers to take that risk of having my website down for hours, days, weeks, who knows how long, as getting my questions answered has been agonizing.
And, finally, I wrote this earlier today:
I’m perfectly happy with EE3, so let me be clear. If delaying is going to 1) give you more time to create step-by-step instructions, 2) improve the ability to automatically migrate more things, and 3) make the overall transition easier, I’m fine with not doing it now.
So are step-by-step, detailed instructions of what to do after deactivating EE3 and activating EE4 on the way? And, if so, when can I expect them?
If you need to escalate this to a higher level tech, please do so, because getting half-answers just makes me more and more frustrated with Event Espresso.
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Josh
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May 30, 2014 at 10:16 pm
Hi John,
Thanks for the follow up, I’ll follow with each of your concerns below:
I asked if the IDs from EE3 get changed to the IDs in EE4, and whether the system generates the new IDs automatically. I still don’t know the answer to that.
The IDs for events in EE3 get automatically changed to new IDs in EE4 when the migration is run. It’s all automatic.
I asked about automatic migration of these items happen automatically: Venues, Questions, Question Groups, Categories (and their associated shortcodes), Email Manager (and their respective, custom-written emails) and Payment Settings. You answered about five out of six of those, but skipped Categories.
Categories are migrated.
I asked “if I eliminated the Custom View template, would that make the migration simpler? If so, is that just a matter of deactivating the “Custom Template Display” plugin?” I never got an answer to that question.
Yes, because the Custom view template doesn’t exist in Event Espresso 4.
I also asked “if the Custom Templates code gets dumped, isn’t there a similar non-Custom Templates code required to replace it? If so, what would be the replacement code?” You answered that “there will be an equivalent,” but didn’t know what the equivalent would be. That’s a pretty critical part of switching from EE3 to EE4, so it’s something that you should know by now.
If you need the Custom View template, I advise to not switch to Event Espresso 4 until there is an equivalent available
I said that I’ve created a demo site, but that none of my website is there, and that the demo site won’t allow me to import anything to it. I’ve gotten no help from you in resolving that problem.
The demo sites are not intended to be a replacement for existing sites. We make these available for demonstration and evaluation of the core Event Espresso 4 software.
If you want to duplicate your site onto your own server, and running the migration there, I can recommend copying everything over to a new location. There are a number of WordPress products that are made for this, notably BackupBuddy and WP Migrate DB Pro.
I said that I was shooting for making the switch to EE4 today (after over a week’s worth of questions, some answered, but too many not answered). I said that I was hoping to beat the June 1 price increase. But I still don’t sufficient answers to take that risk of having my website down for hours, days, weeks, who knows how long, as getting my questions answered has been agonizing.
It might help to explain that the June 1 price increase doesn’t have a bearing on which version you are using now. You can renew right now at a lower price and be locked in for that price for the length of the renewal term. The renewal discounts are version agnostic.
And, finally, I wrote this earlier today:
I’m perfectly happy with EE3, so let me be clear. If delaying is going to 1) give you more time to create step-by-step instructions, 2) improve the ability to automatically migrate more things, and 3) make the overall transition easier, I’m fine with not doing it now.
Okay, I think we are done here then.
So are step-by-step, detailed instructions of what to do after deactivating EE3 and activating EE4 on the way?
No, the migration was built in order to avoid a manual migration process. It takes care of the migration for you and gives you a button on the screen to click. What you do after the migration is covered in the Event Espresso 4 documentation, which you can review here:
https://eventespresso.com/support/documentation/versioned-docs/?doc_ver=ee4
If you need to escalate this to a higher level tech, please do so, because getting half-answers just makes me more and more frustrated with Event Espresso.
I’m sorry that you’re getting frustrated, John. Please have a great weekend and please consider staying on Event Espresso 3 for the time being. If you’re perfectly happy with Event Espresso 3 now, we couldn’t be happier.
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John Fineberg
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May 31, 2014 at 8:47 am
Now that’s what I call an answer! It looks like a lot of things do, in fact, get migrated over automatically. You’re a star! Thanks, Josh.
Okay, I’m slowing down again and thinking about staying with EE3 until all of the EE4 kinks are worked out and features are placed back in. Especially now that you’ve made it clear that the license is “version agnostic.” Now I’m going to ask a question that’s embarrassing to ask. How do I buy another year of support? I’ve looked at the Accounts page, and I see now way to do it there. I’ve looked at the Pricing page, and I do see how to start the process there. But isn’t the pricing different for existing customers than for new customers? If so, where do I go to renew?
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John Fineberg
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May 31, 2014 at 4:58 pm
I just took a leap of faith and clicked on the button to buy a one-year license, and then on the next page it explained that I could renew there. It’s a little backwards presenting it that way, but it worked out in the end.
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Josh
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June 2, 2014 at 9:54 am
I should clarify that while the renewal discounts are version agnostic (you get a renewal discount regardless of which version you are on) the support licenses themselves are not version agnostic. What that means is right now you can buy the lower priced Event Espresso 4-only license, and this does not give you access to Event Espresso 3. If you have an Event Espresso 3 license, it does give you access to Event Espresso 4 beta. If you have any other questions about the licenses, please start a new thread.
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